LifeType 1.3?

Postby tszming on Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:02 am

markwu wrote:But, I just wondering, if we set the cache life time as 86400 secs,


yes, but not a real time solution.

some people talk to me said that they want their post to appear in the main page exactly on a certain time, e.g. 15:30, and i think it is reasonable in fact.

besides this function, cron function maybe also used in :

1. house keeping, e.g. disable blog without activity in the last 3 months
2. generating site statistics, such as how many posts posted yesterday, how many blogs created etc.

also, for the template cache, i think set to -1 is really good, so maybe try another method to load the calendar?
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Postby phunkphorce on Wed Feb 28, 2007 3:47 am

But if you're running such a big site where you need batch jobs to improve your performance, you surely have access to your own dedicated server and therefore access to the "real" version of cron and not some simulated version in PHP (where in my opinion it does not belong)

I have had an idea to implement a framework for scheduled tasks/batch jobs in LT, but they'd be triggered by curl from the command line for some time now, but I haven't had time to implement them. They'd be scheduled via cron and not via PHP, because it's a lot more flexible...
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Postby jondaley on Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:21 am

phunkphorce, the "15:30" type-request can't really be done from a cron job, since the site owner wouldn't know what time to clear the cache, so it should be within LT. I think all the talk about cron jobs makes it sound like a bigger issue than it is. To make the 15:30 post show up at the right time, we should have a list of times of when to clear the cache (per blog - and I am not sure what to do with the summary - I guess that should be cleared as well, though taking the summary cache timeout into account) and then the next view after that time, should clear the cache, and remove the entry from the list.

We would want to do the right thing when there are multiple entries in the list, though perhaps the second call to clear the cache doesn't take too much overhead, if the files are already deleted.

It could be done with a cronjob LT plugin, that sets up a cronjob when the post is made, but that would be more system-specific that a completely LT solution, I think. And I also don't know if clearing the tmp/1 directory is safe - probably there is a race condition if a visitor is looking at the site at the same time.
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Postby elena on Thu Mar 15, 2007 4:26 am

jondaley wrote:I was thinking about tags the other day - I guess I am too old to understand it or something - what is the difference between categories and tags?


Some time ago, -aat- gave a good explanation of tag advantages.

Usually, people that use Tags cloud (i.e: in wordpress) put at least 30-40 keywords in the cloud. It represents topics of the articles, more than categories. Sometimes the tags are extracted directly from the articles by analysing words density. A user can have only 2 categories in his blog (My job, my wife), but the visitors would be interested in viewing several tags to access the content (Programming/computers/my boss/shopping/gifts/love/sex).


I would like to add another idea that one of our users has suggested me. (Many other users have requested us Tags before).

The idea is to use tags to connect the posts that different users write in their own blogs. This is partially achieved by LT Global Article Categories, but it is limited by the choice of categories set by the site administrator.

In contrast, tags could be extracted directly from the articles by analysing words density, as -aat- suggested, or maybe the user could mark the words within the post text, or have a specific field where to add as many words as he likes. Then LT could have a real Tag Cloud in the home page of the blogging communities and each tag would be linked to all the posts that have also used the same tag.

Each article can be assigned to one single Global Article Category, in the contrary tags can be unlimited. While tags can be defined by users, they are democratic, social and innovative; categories can only be added by the site administrators, who may not be aware of all the popular tags.
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Postby jondaley on Thu Mar 15, 2007 9:22 am

So, tags are global categories that can be added by the user?

I talked to a guy yesterday who is interested in doing some global categories, and subcategories, and he would probably be interested in a tagging system that other blogs do. They do seem to be somewhat redundant, but I can see a little bit of usefulness in having both types.
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Postby elena on Thu Mar 15, 2007 3:02 pm

jondaley wrote:So, tags are global categories that can be added by the user?

I just found a good explanation of the differences between Tags and Categories:

Tags or Categories: Which One to Use?

Here is a synopsis of the similarities and differences between tags and categories.

* Categories can have unique names. Tags need to be known names.
* Categories can have long wordy names. Tags should have short one, two, or at the most, three words.
* Categories generate a page of posts on your site. Tags can, too, but often generate a page of off-site posts on an off-site website.
* Categories are not tags. Tags can be categories.
* Categories don’t help search engines find information. Tags help search engines and tag directories catalog your site.
* Posts are usually in one to four categories. A single post can list as many tags as you want.
* Categories help visitors find related information on your site. Tags help visitors find related information on your site and on other sites.

jondaley wrote:I talked to a guy yesterday who is interested in doing some global categories, and subcategories, and he would probably be interested in a tagging system that other blogs do. They do seem to be somewhat redundant, but I can see a little bit of usefulness in having both types.

So do I.

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Postby jondaley on Thu Mar 15, 2007 4:52 pm

Categories can have unique names. Tags need to be known names.

I don't know what this means. It seems the opposite of what we were saying earlier - where categories might be set by the admin, but tags could be created at post-time by the poster, and maybe even auto-generated from the content.

Categories can have long wordy names. Tags should have short one, two, or at the most, three words.

This isn't a technical difference - ie. you wouldn't need to create something in LifeType to do this - just make shorter categories. It is interesting, by the way, since all of my categories are one-word.

Categories generate a page of posts on your site. Tags can, too, but often generate a page of off-site posts on an off-site website.

Not relevant to us?

Categories are not tags. Tags can be categories.


Categories don’t help search engines find information. Tags help search engines and tag directories catalog your site.

I don't understand.

Posts are usually in one to four categories. A single post can list as many tags as you want.

Again, this isn't a technical difference, just how you use them.

Categories help visitors find related information on your site. Tags help visitors find related information on your site and on other sites.

So, categories help visitors find related information, but not search engines find information?

I am afraid I am possibly more confused than before.
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Postby jondaley on Thu Mar 15, 2007 4:54 pm

I just read more from that author. One way of deciding whether something is a tag or a category seems to be whether it exists on technorati or not.
This isn’t much different from tags, but categories are built into the core of my WordPress site. They are set by me and for me to use, allowing me to group my content under a specific umbrella category.

These categories are my choices. Blog Babble is not a Technorati tag or keyword.
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Postby phunkphorce on Thu Mar 15, 2007 5:14 pm

I don't see how we reach the conclusion that categories don't help search engines... How do *tags* help search engines?
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Postby elena on Fri Mar 16, 2007 4:01 am

Categories can have fancy or unique names like "Jonathan Daley" or "LifeType Success Stories", while tags have to be popular key words, such as "family", "son", "CMS" or "success".

I think categories and tags both help users and search engines. The difference is that a user of Jon's blog looking for information about Jon, for example his mother, who already knows that Jonathan Daley is Jon's son, will probably be more pleased to find a category named "Jonathan Daley", than a two tags called "family" and "son".

On the other hand, a search engine who does not know Jon, nor Jonathan Daley, will be able to associate more meaningful information to Jon's blog if al the posts about Jonathan Daley are tagged with the words "family" and "son".

In the same way, a visitor of LifeType's website, will be more pleased to find a Category called "LifeType Success Stories", but a search engine will prefer to find tags such as "CMS" or "success".

I know that the words you use for categories are not a technical issue, but I think that using categories as tags, or tags as categories is not the best thing to do.

I think that there is a plugin for Technorati tags. I haven't tried... but maybe this plugin could be used to generate a real tag cloud on the home page of the blogging service, based on the number of posts by users linked to each tag.
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Postby jondaley on Fri Mar 16, 2007 1:35 pm

I sort of see, but couldn't you just "tag" it with multiple categories, "Jonathan Daley", "family" and "son", if you wanted to?
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Postby elena on Fri Mar 16, 2007 2:29 pm

I think of categories as a way of grouping posts. You normally have a maximum of 12 or 18 categories (Global article categories, or blog article categories), and then, if necessary, have subcategories (not in LT but yes in other context) like in dmoz.org style. Then, when you write a post, or when you have to classify a website, you have to decide in which category, categories, subcategory or subcategories you want to file the post or website.

In contrast, when you want to associate a post or website to tags, you don't have to choose within your category choice (or within the blogging service "Global Article Categories" choice), you just have to think of all the possible key words related your post, as many as you like; usually the most, the best.

For example: Mallorca, the island where I live, is spelled as "Mallorca" (in Catalan, Spanish, German....) and as "Majorca" in UK English. If you have a web directory, or a blogging category tree, you normally choose between Mallorca or Majorca (not both). In contrast, if you use tags, you will probably be linking the post to both tags: Majorca and Mallorca. This is going to help SEO, no doubt!

Some people associate tags to google.com and categories to dmoz.org.
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Postby jondaley on Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:53 am

I'm afraid I don't think I'll ever understand this concept. People keep saying with tags you usually make them up on the spot, or use ones that exist on technorati, etc. and you don't do that with categories. Why not?

It seems like you are trying to explain tags and categories by making up definitions (or getting them from somewhere else) and then showing examples of how you would use them. Try replacing "category" with "tag" and vice versa in your posts - it would make just as much sense to me.
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Postby elena on Sun Mar 18, 2007 1:37 pm

jondaley wrote:I'm afraid I don't think I'll ever understand this concept. People keep saying with tags you usually make them up on the spot, or use ones that exist on technorati, etc. and you don't do that with categories. Why not?


At the very beginning we were talking about using tags as a way of linking posts from different blogs and we said that global article categories can do that but:
- users cannot add global categories on the spot
- users can only link each post to one global article category.

By the way... is it possible to display the global article category and link an article is using, if any? Just like we do with the normal categories? I suppose the necessary code would be something like this, is it right?

Code: Select all
{assign var="artGlobalCategory" value=$post->getGlobalCategory()}
{if $artGlobalCategory}
Global Article Category:
<a href="?op=PostList&amp;globalArticleCategoryId={$artGlobalCategory->getId()}">
{$artGlobalCategory->getName()}</a>
{/if}


Or this is only available in the Summary templates?

Thank you for your help.

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Postby jondaley on Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:33 am

I wasn't saying that nothing needed to change in order to support "tag-like" functionality. And I guess it does seem sort of strange to let people modify global article categories, though unless you are doing free-type tags, instead of selecting them, it seems like you are letting people effectively modify global settings anyway.
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